Today’s guest has Consulted for Golden State Warriors…

Aggregated 120 Billion Impressions on Facebook for a massive case study…

AND Once ran a 70 mile marathon.

Dennis Yu is the Chief Technology Officer of BlitzMetrics, a digital marketing company which partners with schools to train young adults. Dennis’s program centers around mentorship, helping students grow their expertise to manage social campaigns for enterprise clients like The Golden State Warriors, Nike, and Rosetta Stone.

He’s an internationally recognized lecturer in Facebook Marketing and has spoken in 17 countries, spanning 5 continents, including keynotes at L2E, PubCon, Conversion Conference, and Marketo Summit.


Jeremy Slate: [00:02:39] Hey What’s up everybody Jeremy here and guys I’m very excited for today’s guest. He has consulted the Golden State Warriors aggregated 120 billion impressions on Facebook for a massive case study. And once rent a 70 mile marathon. Dennis Yu is the chief technology officer at Blitz metrics a digital marketing company which partners with schools to train young adults Dennis’ program centers around mentorship helping students to grow their expertise to manage social campaigns for enterprise clients like the Golden State Warriors, Nike and Rosetta Stone. He’s an internationally recognized lecturer in Facebook marketing as spoken in 17 countries spanning five continents including keynotes at el to the pub car conversion conference and market summit. You can find out more about him over at Blitz Metrics dot com. Welcome to the on my podcast Dennis Yu!

Dennis Yu: [00:03:45] Jeremy how you doing buddy.

Jeremy Slate: [00:03:46] Hey I’m doing great Dennis.

Jeremy Slate: [00:03:47] I’m really excited to be hanging out with him and follow what you been doing for quite a while now.

Dennis Yu: [00:03:51] Yeah. You know that hundred twenty hundred twenty million impressions is actually six years ago. We have almost a trillion impressions on Facebook.

Jeremy Slate: [00:03:59] Oh my gosh. I read that and I was like wow that’s so impressive. But you up to a trillion already.

Dennis Yu: [00:04:03] Yeah and we have over a billion dollars of that spend but that doesn’t necessarily mean it just means we spend a lot of money.

Jeremy Slate: [00:04:09] That’s awesome. That’s awesome so I guess let’s let’s start out with what’s your story man like how do you how did you end up in this space like tell us where we’ve come from.

Dennis Yu: [00:04:16] Man I’m a Chinese guy that didn’t speak English until I was seven and math was good for me. So any kind of math environment where there’s a lot of data has just been awesome for me. So you know 20 years ago I helped build for American Airlines. And then I ran analytics at Yahoo. And then the Facebook thing came along. And Mark Zuckerberg and I you know we fought on a couple of things but we’ve just found in the ad system on Facebook has so much data. It’s the best analytics repository of all things whether or not we spend money on ads. So for me it’s like going to Disneyland and everything is there and I know a lot of people think of Facebook as a social network but I think of it as a data base.

Jeremy Slate: [00:04:57] Absolutely. So let’s just back to one thing you mentioned there which I find super impressive. You said you didn’t speak English until you were seven years old. Let me ask you because of that. Did you kind of I guess bury yourself in learning other things like because of that or what was that experience like for you you know little kids are really mean to one another.

Dennis Yu: [00:05:15] Right. But that’s like the little kids are honest like if you’re a woman and you should and you want to know whether you’re fat you should ask a little kid of my fat and I’ll tell you right. The little kids they made they made fun of me. If you can remember back to what it was like being 7 or 8 I was I didn’t have the right clothes. I was chubby. I didn’t speak English. I was put in there. I know that the words for these you know words have changed to be more PC but I was in the retarded class literally retard now. Right. And I was and I was not retarded I just didn’t speak English. And so what Americans do when they encounter a foreigner that doesn’t speak English they yell louder as if somehow I don’t understand it a little louder at me. Somehow I’m now going to understand right now. I wasn’t one of those like I was going to commit suicide or it affected me so much I just internalized that and said you know I’m just going to kick your butts. I’m going to learn English. I’m going to study. I’m going to go to the library every day for as many hours as I could. I literally would get dropped off to the library when it opened in the morning even on the weekends too.

Dennis Yu: [00:06:20] And the only time I was not in the library when I was from seven to maybe the age of 16 was when I was in class so I was either I was just in the library all the time on the weekends my dad would come pick me up at 8:00 p.m. from the library. There was this reading contest over the summer I remember at the Palos Verdes Peninsula library. That’s where I kind of grew up in that area in L.A. and you got one little thing on the wall for every book that you read. And so these kids were competing to see who could get the most. And my thing went all the way across the room. No one else was even close. My thing went like 30 feet across the room for everyone. Read the next closest kid was like two feet of books they read like books books. Right. And so that was my thing is reading and learning and I’m like you know what all you guys. Going to learn to read. I’m going to speak better English than all you guys. I represented California in the National Spelling Bee in 1988. Wow. Don’t screw with me. We’ll get to you.

Jeremy Slate: [00:07:16] Well let me ask you that then, Dennis because I feel like that’s really important especially with a lot of very technical things you learned. How do you have some sort of a specialized process where you’re going to kind of dive into learning something new based on that experience.

Dennis Yu: [00:07:29] Yeah so I call this Learn do teach and it’s something that in hindsight is super obvious. There’s several principles. The idea of learn to teach is you’re going to study and learn everything that you can put it into practice immediately and then try to teach other people to see whether you understand it cause you might think you understand it but you don’t. And I like to learn from first person sources so I don’t want to read just what someone else had to say. I want to go straight. That’s why of the books I read. I read mostly autobiographies not by movies because I want to hear it in their voice. I believe that when you hear someone else’s words they are wiring your brain you know a speaker in a microphone and the same thing. But the currents going in opposite directions right. Yeah. So when you hear someone else’s words you’re hearing you they’re helping you wire your brain to think a certain way. And of the successful people that you around you know they use the same phrases they think the same way they have the same paradigms. And so I did speak English so I basically read autobiographies all day long and I wanted to learn about entrepreneurship. So I read you know a Made in America by Walton, Grinding it Out by Sam Kroc, Marriott which is the Marriott story.

Dennis Yu: [00:08:36] I’ve read hundreds of autobiographies. That was how I got mentorship before I was. I knew how to actually get mentors like I had. Al Casey who is the CEO of American Airlines and he mentor me and that’s how I got my first real job and he opened up all kinds of doors it was like cheating. By the way if you’re learning or if you’re doing something if you’re in a job or professional position whether it’s at a company that you work at or to your company do not compete unless you have an advantage. It’s so good it’s like cheating but obviously not illegal. Right. That’s always been my approach is that I I worked really hard but I’m also really lazy too if that makes any kind of oxymoron kind of sense because I want to be in a situation where I’m hanging out with the very best not because I’m just trying to take pictures of myself with Tai Lopez and Ferrari’s or whatever Lamborghini’s but because I’m actually in a situation where I’m around other people that are super successful and know more than me and can teach me. So one of my high school experiences because I then went to a boarding school on the east coast called Chote Rosemary Hall for rich kids if you know about it if you’re a rich parent and then you know that like you know the Saudi princes or whatever they send the kids there.

Dennis Yu: [00:09:45] But I made friends with some of the kids there and I got to hang out with their parents who are all super successful. I just assumed everyone lived like that. I mean you can imagine what that lifestyle is like and one of them I won’t name him just to protect his name because he’s a very not in the public kind of guy but he’s a billionaire and he’s the guy who funded Costco and Best Buy. And I would hang out with him and he would take me on kind of like adopt me as like another son and we would go skiing at some of the resorts that he owned and he had homes all over the world. And I remember we were on the ski lift one time and going up to take a blue dive because I didn’t really know how to ski but he was sort of teach me how to ski. And he took me down and took me down a black and I. I didn’t realize it because I like kind of like the pinks and greens.

Dennis Yu: [00:10:27] I don’t know if you ski…

Jeremy Slate: [00:10:29] I had a black one to scare the crap out of me Dennis!

Dennis Yu: [00:10:33] Mine and these bumps like why do they put all these bombs here. I didn’t have a good time at all that I you know. I wanted to spend time with him and he was like a mentor. But the thing is we spent I remember one time we spent the whole day together and when and it wasn’t like you know these people are super busy I mean the dude the billionaire and all this. But we were going up the ski lift and he pulled out his phone. And now remember we were just chatting the whole time and just having fun and just like he was giving me my giving me full attention as as I was to him which is a hallmark of people who have their act together. They’re not like trying to pretend like they’re busy or multitask. Billionaires never multitask. He in the middle of our conversation he picked up the phone and he issued an order of you know buy 50000 shares of Best Buy or something like that. And then he put the phone away it literally took him like 30 seconds and then he went back to talking and I asked him So why did you do that. You know what was behind that. And he explained to me how he buys and sells companies and I have a finance degree believe it or not I have an economics degree I went to the London School of Economics right now two degrees.

Jeremy Slate: [00:11:39] I have the background great. We have the meats. Wendy’s or is it Arby’s? No We have the background.

Dennis Yu: [00:11:46] I have the degrees but it it wasn’t until a mentor sat me down and explained how finance actually works. I mean I have magna cum loudy I have like all these degrees of all these achievements I have all these classes like I’m what’s called a paper tiger meaning that you know the Asians that basically blow the curves right. They know how to get A’s on tests but they don’t. They don’t know how to behave in person. You know like I was that guy right. Right. Because I just wanted to get A’s and he and folks like Al Casey I told you you know he ran American Airlines and he was the postmaster general and the L.A. Times ran a bunch of things. These mentors taught me that success on. I know this sounds like a get rich quick you know motivational speaker thing but success in my own direct experience has come from finding mentors that care about me and they don’t charge a dime. Do you think that the billionaires are going to like a hundred dollars from some broke college kid like come on. It’s because they cared for me. Right. And then other people that ask go all you know you were like super lucky because you went to this rich boarding school or you met these other people which then because rich people introduce you to other people.

Dennis Yu: [00:12:58] And pretty soon it compounds and that’s what happened. Right. I’ve had dinner with ex-presidents I’ve had dinner with like you name it. And this I’m not trying to name drop but I have. Right. And it’s because folks like Al Casey who’s since passed away and pick up the phone and say hey you know what you did. I want to introduce you to be like the head of Goldman Sachs or something like that. I’m going to introduce you to my young protege Dennis. Hey meet Dennis. We’re going to have lunch together in New York or have dinner. We’re going to hang out and so I got to hang out because when my mentors would give me things to do I would follow up on him and I would do them. And I do everything possible to make my mentors look good and then they would open up their network a little bit more. And so there’s so many people that you know now that I’m in a position where I mentor other people they reach out to me say hey where you mentor me I want to become rich and all this and they don’t they’re not willing to do the homework. They’re not willing to put in the time. And so I have to say respectfully No I’m very busy. Right.

Jeremy Slate: [00:13:54] Well I find that I find it very interesting Dennis because I say just from my own background I came from a very small towns five eighths of a mile. I have a hundred second cousins Sixty first cousins and I’m the first person in my family to go to college. So it really does. Like you’re talking about when you surround yourself like you did with those type of mentors it does really change you know your mindset and as I got older I surrounded myself with more people like I wanted to be like and removed a lot of those people that I grew up with that weren’t really people that I needed to have around me. So like you’re saying to have the right people mentoring you it does make all the difference and you are the sum of the five people you spend the most time with.

Dennis Yu: [00:14:31] So you know everyone valuable but you’ve got to think about the people who want to give you advice. Have no position to you know it’s like everyone can give advice. Everyone has an a hole right. But. It’s from people who have done it before done the thing that you want and that’s made a big impact for me because I wasted 10 years of my professional career listening to everybody because I want I didn’t want to be mean or anything so if someone had an opinion I’d sit down and of course friends and family. They knew that I was doing this Internet marketing thing so I built websites for people. This was 20 something years ago back when it was you know now it’s like nothing with WordPress and themes and all this but you know back then it was a big deal and they thought they were doing favors for me and I didn’t want to say no because somebody who was a friend of mine say they all need to meet so-and-so right and they think that person who’s getting the website built for $50 thinks they’re giving me some kind of opportunity when I’m turning down building internets for 20000 bucks that’s just as much effort as someone’s hundred dollar Web site. Right.

Jeremy Slate: [00:15:26] Right. Well I find that very interesting though is that since mentorship was such a big part in your life it’s really what you’re spending most of your energy on now because when we first got chatting before this interview I said you what’s the thing you’re most excited about right now and you said Well really it’s just one thing it’s meant to bring it scale in and if you had to look at that dentist like what does that look like that idea of mentoring at scale.

Dennis Yu: [00:15:47] Jeremy you think about this think about the best experiences that you have had where you’ve learned something where someone has helped you out where there’s some kind of knowledge in someone’s head some knowledge in your head that you’ve passed on to someone else. Maybe you have in the case or some staff members that you know you’ve helped them out because of something that you’ve been able to do. But have you turned that into a recipe into a checklist. Other people can follow just like a laboratory experiment where if you combine this chemical in that chemical and you heat it up and do this and that you get this particular result right. The lava thing or whatever it is you get a particular result. And for me mentorship is how do you systematize that when we say mentorship it’s scale. All the stuff that I’ve learned how to do so could which I’ve learned from other people. Right because you always start with the purest source. I have sought to write those down into checklists so it could be a checklist on how do you use to post a checklist on how you set up a Web site a checklist on what do you do before during and after a client meeting a checklist on how do you create a statement of work or how do you do think about all the things that you know think about all the things Jeremy for example that you say all the time.

Dennis Yu: [00:16:58] I’m sure there are certain situations and those listening there’s certain things that you say all the time that you just have to repeat to people to explain what you do to explain what you offer to explain you know to tell a particular story. You can take that and systematize it and that’s mentorship. You know education and mentorship are really the same thing. And I believe all marketing is giving way to mentorship. That’s why people are selling courses. Why. Because when you have a course it conveys authority versus you know just buying someone and trying to like cold call and mass spam and that kind of thing. People are too smart for that because it’s too noisy out there. So for me I was just lucky because my focus on mentorship and training and giving back and everything that I’ve learned I want to get back to other folks like young adults and veejays and returning missionaries in the church and what have you. Like that’s just been a natural thing that I’ve been doing the last 20 something years before this whole. Personal Branding, life coaching everyone is successful. You know selling courses I mean just like there’s all this stuff now it’s a fad right.

Dennis Yu: [00:18:00] Influencer marketing. They’re all really the same thing. Or the people that you should listen to. There’s a lot of people yelling their talking heads. Lot of people beating their chests and that the thing is without naming anybody. There’s a ton of them where all you see is them and if all you see is them then you got to wonder is there any mentorship is there. Because if they had a system that the stuff they’re promising that’s going to change your life and you’re going to make $10,000 a month by tomorrow or whatever get rich quick. Lose weight quickly whatever it is they’re promising. If that truly worked then you would see the stories of their people without them needing to ever beat their own chest. That’s why I say you should never work on your own personal brand because other people should be building it for you. The proof should be other people that are following your process. That’s why we have folks like Logan on our team 18 months ago he was working at Pizza Hut delivering pizzas and now he’s an international speaker and he’s hanging out. Mark Zuckerberg and all of us you know got pictures and videos and all the sorts of things because there he is one of the folks that I mentor and I’d love to see his growth and the people that mentored me they love to see my growth.

Dennis Yu: [00:19:06] You know these guys who have a lot of money and are successful in all this like they’re they’re not interested in trying to compete with me. Right. They already have all these things they don’t need to show anything off. So anyone that’s asking you for money and mentorship. Runaway as fast as possible. Anyone where all you see is them talking about themselves. Runaway as fast as possible. Right. You want to see documented proof against the thing that you want. They should be willing to share it. It shouldn’t smell like a commercial. It shouldn’t be based on their lifestyle. I know people I know many billionaires and I know they value their privacy. They they’re not out there flaunting their stuff. Right. Like Steve Forbes he calls his plane the name of his plane is the capitalist tool. Why. Because it saves time. Not because it’s a luxury private jet right. I flew on the private jet for Frito-Lay and you know it’s all real fancy it’s a G-5. And you know you go inside and it looks like you’d imagine it to look and then you open up the cabinets. This freaking lays potato chips and Cheetos and such like. Yup makes a lot of sense. Right.

Jeremy Slate: [00:20:10] But that’s the same reason like this past weekend I had an event in Boston. And rather than flying there from New Jersey because of the waste time here at the airport and everything else you know saves more time to drive to the airport because like you’re saying How do you value your time.

Dennis Yu: [00:20:22] Right. And it’s all about time and mentors. That’s what they give you. And then you give them back.

Jeremy Slate: [00:20:28] And I think that kind of really ties in very well to a really great YouTube video that you had sent me of a talk you did recently where you talked about one of the values that a new employee doesn’t really get is the training they get when they when they come on board. And I think that’s something like for me I’ve used a lot of interns and what I’ve done because I’m able to train them to do a lot of different things and they’re very proficient. You know once they’ve left working for me because of the value of the training and I think that is something that totally gets passed over when they’re like oh well I’m worth $20 an hour I’m worth $100 an hour and they don’t realize the value of what they’re actually getting to the experience what you’re teaching them.

Dennis Yu: [00:21:05] Isn’t that ironic. Yeah. You have these kids and they paid 80 grand, hundred grand whatever for some piece of paper after four years and you can argue I’m not I’m not bagging on college I’m right way that they paid all this money the college didn’t pay them. They paid enough money to buy an exotic sports car used. Yet when they come out and they that’s when their education actually starts. You know the apprentice model has been around forever. Way before the United States. Right. That has always been the case. The folks in United States don’t realize the apprentice model where you’re doing school and you’re doing some kind of job not because the businesses are trying to get slave labor for super cheap or higher in India. It’s because they believe in the careers and these folks who are apprentices or students or mentees understand that there is going to be loyal and stay for a few years and learn a particular trade and open up all of these opportunities and the Met mentors opened their networks and then these folks can then start their own shop or do their own thing or actually go work at the company and you know you maybe then turn in Arthur Andersen or whatever it is Andersen Consulting and now you’re you become an audit specialist or whatever. Right. That that stuff has been lost. You know maybe it’s because you can philosophize you know it’s the loss of respect for your elders or people that the millennials need a prize every 30 seconds for attending for breathing. Right. I mean lots of patience because of the whole like distraction of electronic devices like whatever you want to call it the lost art of mentorship is what I want to bring back not just because of me but because that’s what I’ve learned. That’s what I’ve seen to work just like you said Jeremy you’ve got these interns you’re not doing it because it’s cheap.

Jeremy Slate: [00:22:42] You’re doing it because it has meaning for that because in another you know 10 to 12 weeks I have to find the new intern because that’s just how the process works. But you know I’m getting some help out of it and they’re getting a great learning experience and I think the thing that you said there which I’ve been banging the drum for forever is the idea of apprenticeships and I just think like it’s totally missing in our business world now. I don’t even think it’s just the Millennial generation because it’s been missing for quite a while now and I think really if you look at a lot of the great masters right if you want to be a great painter you worked on the Da Vinci or you know you worked with Raphael or one of these other guys and that’s how you got to be the best at something. And I think a lot of times right now people aren’t willing to put in that learning to really get there.

Dennis Yu: [00:23:21] Well it’s not that they don’t want to do so if you’re a business owner or entrepreneur or whatever you’re trying to get your business going you’re busy you don’t sleep enough you’re cutting the corners you’re just trying to do everything and you’re exhausted. You don’t have enough time or money. Right that’s that’s an entrepreneur need neither. Right. So you don’t have the extra time you think to be documenting what you do. You don’t have the extra three hours day. See I spend at least three hours a day reading. I don’t work on four hours a day. Why. Because I need time mentoring and any time learning so I do. I spend three hours a day learning three hours a day doing three hours a day teaching. Right that’s nine hours a day and I need to exercise I need to sleep I need to work more than three or four hours a day. Right. So think of it this is my mentorship bucket by the way this is teaching right. Learning new teaching bucket your time into those three categories. Most people they’re are so so busy because the foam if you’re missing out that they are constantly trying to have meetings that are unnecessary they want to talk to people because of what is this next thing could be.

Dennis Yu: [00:24:18] And so they use that well what if they use that to justify wasting their time and they replace the the important for the urgent. Right. And those are not the same things. And we focus on things that are important. So you may see like you saw that talk I gave on you know how do you scale your business using Facebook ads for a dollar a day. Every one of those techniques there is timeless. It’s not based on the latest changes to try to trick Facebook’s algorithm. It’s all very basic it’s based on things like word of mouth and you look at the things that work in your business and they’re timeless and everything else. I don’t find myself easily distracted or I don’t fall for all this thing just happened on Google or Facebook did this or snapchat. I don’t fall for that anymore. I used to 10 years ago.

Jeremy Slate: [00:25:01] Well so what does that look like for implementation in your like when you’re when you’re putting that into you know you talked about how you train veejays how you train people who are going to work with you like in terms of implementation what does that look like for you. I know for me it’s a lot of video and a lot of things like that connect me use over and over again. So what does that look like for you.

Dennis Yu: [00:25:16] So if you’re a mentor then you know people learn different ways. Some people learn by watching other people doing it. You know some people learn by reading it. Some people watch videos some people you know whatever. So we found that any piece of training that we have we keep in our content library we number it we have a thousand videos in our library it’s all unlisted and we number it in you should number your stuff. You know one to a thousand one to 20 maybe that’s all you have. Right. And for any particular piece of content we have a video version and we have a guided version which is how we we document it shot step by step and people can choose which one they want to learn all the tasks are linked together. So you know how to build a web site how to build a three by three video grid for your why how and what how to optimize the face look at how to do whatever a how to is really a one two three four five. Do these steps in sequence so the tasks are task number two three four five six seven is how you accomplish a sequence and we call that the 1000 ingredient kitchen because any of these ingredients you can assemble in a certain order and you can get the particular dish you want chocolate chip cookies BBQ chicken you know whatever you want.

Dennis Yu: [00:26:26] So that’s what I think about in our restaurant if you will for that analogy that any meal that we need to produce has to be something on the menu not custom. We can customize meaning we can sprinkle cheese on it but we’re not going to do custom is and we’re going to make you know Foie Gras and we don’t know how to do that because duck liver is hard to work with. Right. We’re not going to be doing anything custom in it doesn’t so people think oh you’re just like McDonald’s because everything’s like a number to go your meal and it’s double cheeseburgers like no. A Tesla is also a repeatable model. It’s a you know process that people follow it’s a package and so everything that you should do from an operation standpoint in your business everything in your business should be a package. Now some people say Well that eliminates creativity and you know I want to do custom things for clients because they want to appreciate the fact that you know whatever have expertise and I’m not just a number and you know paint by the numbers. No that’s not true at all because. So Jeremy if you have you ever been to the hospital and had surgery or had a broken bone or something like that.

Jeremy Slate: [00:27:26] No let’s not get into that one though it didn’t go so well. But anyway you went to the hospital

Dennis Yu: [00:27:32] And you’re all about you yeah I want a custom solution. And you’re like hey I don’t want to use any of the medical procedures that are proven to you know fix my bone or do the surgery or do like whatever I want the doctor to come up with something new and innovative. Or would you would you rather go to the surgeon that says you know I’ve done this. I’ve done Lasik 10,000 times. It’s totally routine. I mean it’s easy. You know we’ve got a whole process around it. Right. Would you rather go to that doctor where it’s just a matter of fact and they do it all the time. Or the one where it’s like, Yeah we’re going to try this new thing it might kill you but it could be also really innovative.

Jeremy Slate: [00:28:02] Well that’s so true though can I even just saw I just saw Malcolm Gladwell do an interview up in Boston over the weekend where he was interviewing a doctor that said I had the most groundbreaking thing in medicine I have everyone do checklists and he goes by 90 percent. You know the actual issues we’re having from surgery’s dropped because they were doing checklists the checklist manifesto and so everything that we do is also driven by checklists.

Dennis Yu: [00:28:22] So it should be c operationally it should be you know the difference between leadership and management right management is working in your business executing checklist following rules and leadership is about doing new things. It’s blazing the path you know you’re having a path to the jungle. The leaders are at the front of it. Blazing new trails figure out how to do stuff and operations or management is going along the trail forward from the very front all the way to the back sweeping the leaves making sure people aren’t getting lost. You cannot be a leader and a manager at the same time. Because you cannot be sweeping the trail and going all the way to the back and finding people that got lost or got you know got sick because they didn’t drink through water and the guy all the way to the front and hacking all the leaves and killing snakes and you know clearing the path like he can’t do both. So people fail in business because they want to be the cause everyone claims their CEO. Right now everyone says their CEO is just them. Well if you could if you walk away from your business for a week or two it it falls apart. You don’t you’re not a CEO. You don’t have a business you think you got an agency and you walk away and it’s not working. One of my friends is named Tom Nerine his business card. The last 20 years is that Tom and associates and it’s just him and I said Tom where’s all your associates you know process got no people process or platform Those are the three.

Dennis Yu: [00:29:40] So everything we do with mentorship makes sense from a business standpoint because anything on the kind of lazy person if I’ve done something three times I’m not going to want to do it again I’m going to make sure I got some training going to pass it off to someone else to do it and that way I’m I’m the kind of I’m a tech geek who likes to experiment and come up and do stuff I don’t want to do the same thing over and over again. So we’re always passing it down the checklist. And that’s a mentorship system it’s not MLM although it has some aspects of we have a 9 level system right. So level 3 you can train a one a fork and train a two and a 1 and you can train anyone that’s two levels below that you can only train things that you have done yourself. And we don’t have people that will come in like oh I can run your business I got 20 years of experience I should be level 8. Well no. Because we promote from within just like Wal-Mart and you know you train up based on your demonstrated expertise which is learn do and teach. There are some people that come in they want to teach on stuff they’ve never done. In fact the majority of the self-help people out there they’re teaching stuff they’ve never done or they’ve done at one time how to make $50,000 on Instagram or you know get a thousand likes. Yeah you did that one time

Jeremy Slate: [00:30:42] I feel like I’m complaining about that for endless amounts of time Dennis. You know I’m going to teach you how to do a weapon or to sell teaching webinars to other people. It’s insane It really is. And I love what you’re saying because for me when I’m looking at a lot of the processes I have written up the thing that I’m not doing is I’m not taking those bigger processes and breaking them down like you said into a one two and a three to kind of break them down like that. I love that. It really is kind of like simplifying it even more.

Dennis Yu: [00:31:55] Figure out where you have the most value. Take that complex thing and break it into a bunch of tasks so that you know maybe if you have a 9 level system of complexity maybe you’re at nine because you have all the strategic whatever. But I believe you can take big things and break them into little pieces that other folks can then assemble It’s like you know the iPhones this crazy thing that’s what does the new like twelve hundred bucks the iPhone 10. It’s too much. It’s all assembled by people in China making like 20 cents an hour or something like that right. You can take anything complex and break it into pieces that can be systematically executed and you can then scale it and that’s when you’re working you know the business operations you should push off to someone that can manage it in that way you can work on your business instead of in your business so it’s more like you’re an investor instead of someone has to actually be there and like put your finger in the dam otherwise that thing falls apart.

Jeremy Slate: [00:32:42] Well and I think too like like like just just take it down to the simple level of let’s look at somebody like Tony Hawk right. He has the basics down on what he does so well that he can do some pretty crazy stuff on a skateboard. And that’s really what it comes down to you’re saying well people don’t want to do things that are that basic but that’s actually a high level of skill is having those basics master so you can actually think with it and work with it you know how to spot a pro in digital marketing really see how you look for the people that focus on the fundamentals all the time.

Dennis Yu: [00:33:12] And you know how to tell someone who’s an amateur or a wannabe or a blowhard someone who it’s like the people who suck at golf the ones who suck real bad. They want to play from the blacks like way in the back where it’s too hard for them folks like me. I focus on the basics all day long like we look at a time she master they do the same moves over and over again. And so I do goals, content and targeting all day long because all the components of digital marketing whether it’s Facebook or whatever break break into the strategic re-useable components of goals, content and targeting and so other people at guy can do this thing empower it or which is going away or there’s new dynamic creative. So there’s this new thing where you know Google Amp integrates now Facebook instant articles. I know all about that but don’t talk about it. Not because it’s a secret but because I focus on the fundamentals. One of my friends His name is Arnoldo and he is a super-duper math genius. Like I’m pretty good at math but this guy is like way above. He’s like sitting at the Mt. Everest of mathematics. OK. Just like it 5,000 feet he’s like way up there. And I remember that I had the opportunity to spend two years with him because he went to school together. And I’ve since kept in touch and he’s and he had a guy who was just enthralled thrall he would sit down you know like some people talk about working on cars or whatever their favorite sports team this guy would sit down and talk about mathematics.

Dennis Yu: [00:34:23] And that’s kind of what we do going to dinner and talk about mathematics. Don’t judge me. And then he would explain. I remember one of the things he told me he said because I always seek out the primary people and not people who talk about eye to eye seek out that people actually are the top because why go through all this like Game of you know game of gossip or whatever telephone tech. And he told me you know Dennis there’s there’s something that you learn Flint when you like. The first thing you learn in calculus first semester calculus is you take the first derivative right. Pretty easy or you take an integral and I’ll say you know there’s something you learn when you’ve when you solved an integral for the first time. It’s like this aha moment like I got this thing down I mean it took me an hour but I got it done and there’s something that you learn in appreciation a deeper level of understanding when you’ve done 10 integrals than what you’ve done 1000 integrals. There’s something that you learn that like little nuances that you wouldn’t have realized. Right.

Dennis Yu: [00:35:11] So understanding’s when you’ve done 10,000 or 100,000 you are at a level of expertise and knowledge that other people will never be able to get to unless they put in that kind of time. That’s not to say you’re just beating yourself repeating the same mundane stuff. But if you’re actively thinking as you do it and we have these nine principles and call the nine triangles you know learn to teach where disengagement conversion you know a metric is action goals, content, targeting all these things like when you learn these fundamental principles over and over again you get to these higher levels of understanding that are timeless. And I know this sounds like some sort of religious, spiritual thing but that is absolutely what I have learned. Especially spending time with mentors. You know the hallmark of a mentor that really knows their stuff is that they tell you stuff that seems kind of obvious and I think Einstein even said that he said genius is simplicity man and genius is taking things that are difficult and making them simpler and taking things that are nearly impossible and making them like even possible. Everything from people that are really smart like really knowledgeable. You’ll hear they use plain words and anyone who uses these really big words and all they are bullshit artists because they’re trying to hide behind terminology and acronyms and they’re not speaking in clear concepts.

Jeremy Slate: [00:36:26] Absolutely. Let me ask you Dennis just because we’re over the amount of time I promised you but I still have more questions for you. Do you have another 15 minutes to go. OK awesome I just want respect your time. So you’re you’re talking about the basics and the things that are really important and one of the things that you’re really banging the drum for is your dollar a day Facebook program as well as a real basic that a lot of entrepreneurs should have. So what is that Dennis.

Dennis Yu: [00:36:49] So the dollar a day which works on Facebook or any kind of paid channel is a simple idea that whatever’s working I want to get more of. I want to amplify. Throw fuel on the fire. And if you do things the way Facebook wants and do things the way Google wants for example Facebook really likes video and one minute videos they they give you advantages in terms of analytics and they give you more exposure to news feed especially going live notifications. Anyway there’s all these reasons why Google and Facebook both want to put out video and video that gets engagement that tells your story that then can move to native ads and e-commerce and other kinds of integrations and you can sell things too. But anyway one minute videos have been working so well that when you put out a bunch little one minute videos like Logan right now is at the dog park with his dogs Sidney a black lab and you know taking videos of Sidney just like jumping in the water and not talking about internet marketing getting people to understand who he is and then they see oh here’s stuff that you know I’m going to we’re going to San Francisco tomorrow because we’re going to watch the opening night of the Warriors versus the rockets right. Nice. And that’s the advantage of having awesome clients. You know we almost got for his decline. He’s going to get a new car for that. Oh well we are always like we have we have you know mattress companies so they’ll give us mattresses things like that.

Dennis Yu: [00:38:04] Right. But he’s documenting these basic things and creating one of make videos and creating lots of them because we know that every 10 will maybe have one that’s good. And so of lots of posts maybe lots of articles and every 10 find one that’s good. So are you going to put a dollar a day against the ones that are starting to look good and the ones that are that start to perform that drive leads and clicks and sales and whatever we’re going to put more. So a dollar a day for seven days is seven dollars. So we’re having lots and lots of micro experiments for a dollar for $7. People say Oh but I’m I’m more sophisticated and I spend a lot more money than you can’t get there for a dollar a day. Well if you have 100 different posts that are all targeted at different points in the funnel. Based on remarketing people watch video 1 watch video two people saw video three 7 lead at this. People who like this like that people in this look. There’s all these different complex sequences which build your funnel which is combinations of goals content and targeting based on custom audiences. Then all of a sudden you’re starting to flesh out in an organic experimental You know naturally developing sort of way a funnel that’s working. Lots of little experiments so that that post that you boosted you know a couple of days ago a dollar a day. It started to work fine. I’m going to put it a dollar a day for 365 days.

Dennis Yu: [00:39:16] Wow. I’m going to I’m going to. Then multiply that and maybe initially I’m speaking at social media marketing world so I’m targeting social media examiner but then I find that you know then I get interviewed by you know whoever. Tony Robbins so then I’m going to amplify that to Tony’s audience and then we get covered in you know the for example last week you saw probably I was in The Washington Post talking about the whole Russian ads. You know the Russian operatives are running Facebook ads to manipulate the election and the hundred thousand dollars and Facebook having to give the 3,000 ads and all this stuff about manipulating. Right. Well there’s an article in The Washington Post so I boosted that article to the people who work at The Washington Post New York Times L.A. Times all that kind of stuff and then every time I’ve gotten a citation I got cited at NPR again I got site in the L.A. Times again tonight continue to re-market to other audiences which is the point of influence and PR and word of mouth the dollar a day strategy is a paid extension of what works in reviews CEO word of mouth PR like the all the same thing but just different words based in different channels. But it’s the same fundamental concept of amplification which is something that’s good. I wanted to be evergreen and I wanted to live forever. For example we have a quarterly workshop three full days that we hold at Infusionsoft headquarters. Thank you to them and we have a post.

Dennis Yu: [00:40:39] We have a video that promotes it saying hey everybody we’ve got this workshop coming up it’s Infusionsoft headquarters. Here’s what we cover. You know and it shows pictures of people that are happy it shows some reviews and testimonials of people that are important you know. So we just had our workshop two weeks ago. But we’re not going to make a new post about the workshop we’re going to take that existing post or we’re going to edit it say instead of say hey it’s it’s you know September 28 that’s where we say hey it’s January 24th and we’re taking that same post. And remember it’s already got a ton of views on it. It’s already got a ton of likes and comments on it. Right now we’re doing is changing that post and then we’re maybe updated the audience who we’re keeping the same audience because we’re speaking at traffic and convergence summit and all these other conferences that we’re going to target those places so we can change things that have worked we can change the audience we can change the budget we can turn things on and off. So if I wanted to I could prank our friends over at you Udacity we’re helping you know create some digital market courses together with them and Facebook which is great. Right. So we could target all the employees at Facebook. I think that audience is still there. And you know take any of the posts that we’ve made the thousands of posts and then just target that to the Facebook folks just for the next two days while we’re over in San Francisco tomorrow.

Dennis Yu: [00:41:49] Think about reusing. You ever heard you know the Greek mythology. You know there’s a guy Sisyphus first and he rolls the ball up the hill you know that they get all these great Greek myths basically the gods that are all doing dumb things. You can laugh at them. So Sisyphus rolls the ball up the hill. Well all you marketers and entrepreneurs out there doing the same thing you’re rolling that dang ball up the hill or you’re getting your liver liver eaten every day or you’re like whatever the analogy is why don’t you create your list of greatest hits your greatest content your greatest testimonial to the greatest. Maybe you’ve got you spoken at different places and you want to create a speaker. You’ll have to do it our viewers will do it right. Why don’t you re-use what you have boosted and have it live forever. Right. That’s the key to like the Four Hour Work Week is how do you systematize what you have. That’s the key to a checklist manifesto. You must build that time to systematize meaning you have to say no to a bunch of things that are questionable. You know Mari Smith she told me something a few years ago though never forget because I was I remember I complained to her one time because I you know there’s mentors of mine and I and you probably do this too right. You just you complain to your mentor right.

Jeremy Slate: [00:42:53] Yes exactly.

Dennis Yu: [00:42:56] You know so-and-so is a total asshole and they’ll all sit there and listen to you. Are you done yet. Because I’m about to give you some advice and the advice is drop that person or you should be wasting time doing this. But Mary Smith gave me the advice and she said because I was complaining to her about men I’m so busy and I’d sleep enough and then this person shopped in the media and this other thing happened and so-and-so didn’t come through and flaked out and she said Dennis if it is not a hell yes then it’s a no. So if you’ve got a list of people that want to interview you. Or projects that you may want to take and it’s a maybe or it could be you know what it might be this next to any of those. Any time you hear yourself doing that the answer is no because you want to be able to look at your calendar and know that every single meeting you have on there every single project you’re working on is a hell. Yes. So when you open your calendar when you open your e-mail and you see stuff in there you can feel like yeah I’m excited at Christmas you’re excited about opening presents. Not like ha. Dang I got a hang on this John it’s like you know like now it’s it’s a hell.

Dennis Yu: [00:43:59] Yes. So your calendar your time life is too short. You should have nothing but hell yess there. And by the way do this for your people too. Now this is going to sound like mean or whatever. But look. So we were talking before we started recording. I think I told you we’ve hired all these ways. We’ve got a process for this. And you know we had lots of people not just via’s a lot of college kids too. And if they are not. Hell yes. Oh yeah I know but the really good here. But they flake you over there are there. They’re good. Yes about this and know about that. And so we have other people interview and some people will say yes and other people we like you know they might be good if we just give them some time. Anything that is a make maybe means no. By the way if you’re if you have a team of people retiring or you’re looking to hire and you’ve got list these people that you’re looking at and some of them look promising. If it’s a maybe. Maybe means no. The only people you hire. The only projects you take on are a hell yes. Absolutely. A lot of people say that and still think oh that’s just a fancy way of saying prioritize. Yeah. But are you doing it.

Jeremy Slate: [00:45:03] Most people are and I think that’s the biggest problem out there.

Dennis Yu: [00:45:06] Here’s another one. For people that charge money like if you own your own business try this one. This is we charge a lot of money ironically to give this advice. We’ve done this with agencies. We tell them double your price. Seriously just double your price. Yeah but I’ll lose all my clients. No. Well good. Know you’ll keep a few of them that really matter. And then that will give you the time to be able to do it because you need two or three hours a day to be able to build process. Right. How much time Jeremy do you spend a day working. How much do you spend learning doing and teaching.

Jeremy Slate: [00:45:37] Like if you were to allocate between those three buckets I probably spend most of my time on creating processes and then teaching other people how to use them.

Dennis Yu: [00:45:45] So you can’t charge time for consulting or billing clients or stuff like that. I mean you can’t spend more in a few hours a day doing that right now. Now so everyone listening here how much time are you spending doing. You’re probably not spending enough time learning or teaching. Therefore you don’t you can’t create skeletal systems maybe you give lip service to this thing be important but I bet you you don’t do it. I bet you you are monitoring for mentions where people are saying good things about you on Twitter or whatever maybe they have and. But you didn’t record it and you’re not putting that in your content library. You’re not using it and you’re not taking like one of our friends here. He created this this tool called warfare plugins. It’s a WordPress plugin and it lets you do all kinds of cool stuff right. And Michael Steltzner of social media examiner started using it and he said wow this is a really good plug in and I was using all these other ones it’s amazing. And you know Jason Yser founded it he looked at this and said yeah that that’s great. Michael can I call you on that. We took Michael’s post because he’s important in the world of social media marketing if you’re doing social media market.

Dennis Yu: [00:46:42] He’s the guy and he shared it from warfare plugins and he boosted it. So it wasn’t enough to share it. He had to boost it to Michael’s community so all the people who were fans of Social Media Examiner see that their leader is the one saying he should be using warfare plugins to manage you know your social shares and mentions and things like that right. Wow. And that’s using the dollar a tactic which is kind of funny. And then we call that interception. Right. Inception is the dream inside the dream inside the dream could you make them feel like it was their idea. Right. And that’s all it is. But if you have if you follow learn do teach. If you have solid goals content targeting in terms of what you stand for and these sequences you know are good because you’ve tested it because you put a buck against that then ten bucks against it then like whatever. Then you have no risk. It’s like going to Las Vegas and you know that you know like you know the roulette wheel What has it got like 48 reds and blacks and double zero. If you could if you could play roulette. And you know you have a 49 percent chance of winning that’s how the house winds on the extra 1 percent.

Dennis Yu: [00:47:34] If you know that you can eliminate even just two or three of the numbers By the way that a friend of mine went to Vegas and he had the. This is years ago that he would go in with a little camera on his lapel on his jacket and it would measure how fast the roulette wheel was spinning. And it would estimate within a range like with what it would be and it would. So it wouldn’t be able to predict exactly would be like all red 13 or something wouldn’t be able to predict exactly but it could eliminate just two or three of the numbers on the wheel. And that was enough to be able to make money. Now imagine you’re playing Facebook and it’s like Las Vegas. And you know that you’re going to win 60-70 percent of the time but actually you know what just to make it easy Jeremy let’s say you know you’re going to win 51 percent of the time. Now would you go in and let’s just say that for sake of simple math you have $10,000 in the bank and that’s all you have. That’s it. You have $10,000 and you have a 51 percent chance of winning.

Jeremy Slate: [00:48:33] Would you would you put a $10,000 bet down probably not be too afraid to lose.

Dennis Yu: [00:48:38] All right would you put a $10 bet knowing you have a 51 percent chance of winning. Yeah. Because if it works I’ll get more money behind it. And you do it over and over and over and over again right. Yeah. And so the same is true. So so in economics this is what you get with a fancy degree. You have risk aversion and risk loving. So let’s say I said Let’s say we have this good example the same one you have $10,000 in the bank and you need it for rent and whatever you need to do. Right. And I kind of say all right we’re going to flip a coin 50/50 tails. You’re going to get nothing and heads you’re going to get a million dollars. OK. Or I’m going to give you $200,000 for sure. Like would you want to play the game or $200,000 for sure. You have $10,000 in the bank you need it for rent and food and cars and kids and things like that. What are you going to do.

Jeremy Slate: [00:49:29] I don’t know if I’d want to give that up if I knew I really needed it up out.

Dennis Yu: [00:49:32] So you would choose the $200,000 for sure wouldn’t you. Yeah probably even though the expected value of the coin flip this half a million. Right because you have a 50 percent chance of the million dollars.

Jeremy Slate: [00:49:40] Now there’s still a 50 percent chance I could get nothing.

Dennis Yu: [00:49:44] But if if you had a billion dollars in the bank and you get a 50-50 on a million what would you do.

Jeremy Slate: [00:49:50] I’d go for it because I had more money in the bank than matters.

Dennis Yu: [00:49:53] So the dollar day principle is de-risking because you can afford to spend a dollar. You can afford to boost 30 or 40 one minute videos because the odds are you’ll get three or four that work. It is low risk. Another thing we call that is many shots on goal which we call metrics analysis action or communicate iterate delegate which is about doing lots and lots of rapid experiments. For example let’s say you’re at the Warriors game with us tomorrow. And they have a challenge where if you can make this half court shot during halftime you win a free kick or Audi or whatever that forgot who had as a sponsor now right now would you feel that there’s pressure. If they said you know Jeremy we’re giving you an hour you can take as many shots as you want from half court. Let’s say you suck a basketball but you can take as many shots as you want. Do you feel like there’s any kind of risk of you being able to make just one.

Jeremy Slate: [00:50:42] You’ve got an hour to make as many shots as you want as bad of a basketball player as I am I could probably make one within an hour. All right.

Dennis Yu: [00:50:49] So do you feel that this could be a stadium full of people. Right. Do you feel that there’s risk. Know there’s risk but I think in an hour I’m bound to make one yet versus what if you only get one shot. And the crowd’s raging and you have like 10 seconds right to make your one shot. Here you are one shot goes in or does it.

Jeremy Slate: [00:51:06] Oh Steph Curry I make it up for anybody else. Now

Dennis Yu: [00:51:10] You’re out. You’re a white guy. And That’s funny. I remember looking at his you know we monitor stuff for the Warriors and somebody commented on one of the highlight videos of Steph Curry making all these because he said a three point record and. Someone commented the fair skinned ninja or light skinned the Sasson or something we had to delete that comment or whatever I thought was hilarious. And it’s funny looking at the comments these people. But the point is that when you have many shots on goal reduces risk especially when the each shot it there’s less pain and most people lay there so like I don’t know they procrastinate or whatever it is they end up taking only one shot at the very last second. So if you’re a procrastinator and you turn in your stuff at the last second prior to the deadline instead of just getting it done first right away because you’re distracted because you have all these different meetings. You’re in that guilty bucket. And ninety nine percent of the people we know are in that guilty bucket. We like to do stuff right away not because we act immediately but because we don’t want to be up against the wall where we’re depending upon a buzzer beater.

Dennis Yu: [00:52:09] I just don’t want to be in that situation. But those of us who are smart who are really smart actually end up thriving in that. And like that situation I know a lot of us. I’m sure you’re like that you’re super intelligent where you know that you’ve been able to get away with it. But if you try to do that in business you will get slammed. Yeah but you can’t win every time. Right in the movies you see like the clocks ticking down in the very last second they’re able to like defuse the bomb before the thing explodes. And the very last second they jump out of the building before you know it collapses at the very last second. This is like the idea of having things happen at the very last second is the exact opposite of what we want. It’s just like when you were a Boston or you know the guy you interviewed the surgeon’s checklist manifesto you don’t want to be like all the surgeons going to the patient’s going to die in 30 seconds if we can’t like slap their heart quick enough right. You don’t want to be in that situation.

Jeremy Slate: [00:52:56] Absolutely not. Well Dennis, I really appreciate you hanging out with us today Man I feel like I went to school. I have and we are going to bring it back again man I have a whole other page of notes from everything you’ve been talking about today. So for people listening if they want to find your dollar a day strategy and if they want to find you on line where is going to be the best place for them to go.

Dennis Yu: [00:53:15] And don’t friend me on Facebook I’m at the 5000 friend limit. Hit me up on Linked In. Data splits metrics is my e-mail. Dollar days at which is Facebook for a dollar a day and if you really want someone who knows what they’re doing you should bring Logan on to the interview because I’m a I’m probably better known. But if you want someone who’s actually been in the weeds. Logan young in my opinion is the number one Facebook ad expert on the planet ahead of me too.

Jeremy Slate: [00:53:41] I blew up the hook that up and guys you can expect that in the future. Dennis you thank you so much for being on the Create Your on my podcast today.

Dennis Yu: [00:53:47] Hey thanks Jeremy.

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